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can someone please settle an arguement?

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can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  Akasha on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 22:30

I have a lovely baby angelfish who is pure white




I'm a member of another general fish keeping forum and one the members is trying to convince me this angel is a Pearlscale angel. I say she's a Platinum angel.

Can someone settle it for us? It's not an arguement as such ... just a 'difference of opinion' lol
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  Pterophyllum on Fri 08 Aug 2014, 23:27

It's possible for it to be both pearlscale & platinum.

A platinum is a gold angel with two Philippine Blue (pb) genes. Like pb, gold is also a recessive gene, in other words, a fish must inherit two copies of the gene (one coming from each parent) for the gene to "express". A fish with only one copy is said to be heterozygous for the gene, you may also see expressions like "with a hidden pb gene" or a fish described as "carrying" a pb gene. In genetic notation a platinum angel would be written g/g - pb/pb.

Like gold and Philippine blue, Pearlscale is also considered a recessive mutation. In Homozygous fish (those with two copies of the gene) the scales become deformed forming a ridge & furrow pattern


Compare this with the skin of a normal fish


However, if you look closely at a fish that's heterozygous for pearlscale, you can see the influence of even a single copy of the gene



Unfortunately it's not quite that simple, the deformation of the scales is gradual, young pearlscales start to "pearl" at between 3 & 6 months. Some fish seem to express pearlscale more strongly than others, so it can sometimes be difficult to be sure if a fish is a pearlscale, or simply heterozygous for the gene.
Looking at the flanks of your fish, there's obvious signs of the gene, but at this stage I'm not sure, but my guess is that it probably is a pearlscale, and that as it matures the pearlscaling will become more obvious, but it may prove just to be a carrier.

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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  Akasha on Sat 09 Aug 2014, 10:04

okay, thanks for that ... it doesn't matter to me which she is really she's lovely either way Smile


Edit: Now I've looked at photo's of pearlscale I really hope she doesn't turn out like that. I don't like the look of the bumpy scales ... the photo's made me shudder.
She's not going anywhere though, what will be, will be  Neutral 
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  Akasha on Thu 14 Aug 2014, 18:13

hi again, just an update on this lovely little fish. She's grown a bit now and last night I noticed that the stripes on her dorsal have gone from pure white to blue. Could that be something to do with the Philippine blue gene? And is it likely that more blue will start showing up elsewhere?

I'm just interested to know more Smile

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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  Pterophyllum on Thu 14 Aug 2014, 19:04

Blue striations are quite normal not just on platinums, but on most blue varieties and indeed on many non blue varieties.

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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  Akasha on Thu 14 Aug 2014, 19:36

okay thank you. I'll continue to watch her grow and watch to see what comes out colour wise Smile
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  peaches on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 18:49

Akasha wrote:okay, thanks for that ... it doesn't matter to me which she is really she's lovely either way Smile


Edit: Now I've looked at photo's of pearlscale I really hope she doesn't turn out like that. I don't like the look of the bumpy scales ... the photo's made me shudder.
She's not going anywhere though, what will be, will be  Neutral 

Don't be put off by that close up. I have a few pharmacies and they look lovely. See the male in my avatar? He is albino pearlscale. I also have some gold pearls and they are very glitzy.

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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  Akasha on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 20:02

thanks Peaches .... I'm just gonna wait and see how she turns out as she grows. She's not growing as fast as the smokey blushing angels I've also got but then she's not as aggressive at feeding time.

I like the blue markings that are coming out on her dorsal fin though Smile I hope more blue markings come through Smile
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  peaches on Sun 24 Aug 2014, 20:51

peaches wrote:
Akasha wrote:okay, thanks for that ... it doesn't matter to me which she is really she's lovely either way Smile


Edit: Now I've looked at photo's of pearlscale I really hope she doesn't turn out like that. I don't like the look of the bumpy scales ... the photo's made me shudder.
She's not going anywhere though, what will be, will be  Neutral 

Don't be put off by that close up.  I have a few pharmacies and they look lovely.   See the male in my avatar?  He is albino pearlscale.  I also have some gold pearls and they are very glitzy.


Just noticed ... pharmacies?? Damn the phone with predictive text. I am back home now and can use my laptop.
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  peaches on Sun 24 Aug 2014, 20:53

Akasha wrote:thanks Peaches .... I'm just gonna wait and see how she turns out as she grows. She's not growing as fast as the smokey blushing angels I've also got but then she's not as aggressive at feeding time.

I like the blue markings that are coming out on her dorsal fin though Smile I hope more blue markings come through Smile

My platinums are slower growing than my smokies, which I bred myself. Not sure why.
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  Akasha on Mon 25 Aug 2014, 11:18

thanks for letting me know... the two smokey's have paired up now and so the little platinum pearlscale and the little marbled that I got with her are constantly getting told off by the smokey's. I'm keeping an eye on it, the marbled has got some damage to her dorsal fin but it's fairly minor and it may not have been the smokey's that did it. I'm hoping and praying that I'm not going to be forced to re-home the pearscale and the marbled but we'll see how things go for now.
Why do cichlids have to be so damn aggressive!
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  peaches on Mon 25 Aug 2014, 15:27

Akasha wrote:thanks for letting me know... the two smokey's have paired up now and so the little platinum pearlscale and the little marbled that I got with her are constantly getting told off by the smokey's. I'm keeping an eye on it, the marbled has got some damage to her dorsal fin but it's fairly minor and it may not have been the smokey's that did it. I'm hoping and praying that I'm not going to be forced to re-home the pearscale and the marbled but we'll see how things go for now.
Why do cichlids have to be so damn aggressive!

I have realised its part of a cycle when they pair up. I have always bought half a dozen or so youngsters in order for them to pair up, which they do, then inevitably there are winners and losers. I usually sell on the unpaired ones, but I am happy to do swaps if anyone is close enough!
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  Akasha on Mon 25 Aug 2014, 16:16

Hopefully iy won't come to a point where I have to re-home the 'spares' (as in the pearscale and the marbles - both female) as it well it may be that I have to bring my 100 litre tank back in from the shed and re-set it up for the smokey pair and keep them alone in there. The fish store that I got them from requested I bring them any young I might possibly get and I have another local store that might also be interested in any young I might get aswell. If that is the case then it might make sense to keep this breeding pair alone in a tank and be able to watch the breeding process and the parental care too.

I bred my laetacara curviceps more than once but then only way to raise the fry was to take some away at free swimming stage as in the community tank the fry didn't last long. I managed to raise a batch of 8 first and then a batch of 18 on the second attempt but it meant I missed out on watching the parental care that I read about. Unfortunately I couldn't get either of my lfs' interested in taking them so I just allowed further spawns to be eaten in the community tank.

I don't think I'll have any problems shifting smokey blushing angel fry though so by moving the breeding pair it would allow me to keep the other two females in the big community tank. It's something I need to think about as the reason the 100 litre tank went into to the shed was for lack of space and running costs!
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

Post  peaches on Mon 25 Aug 2014, 20:28

Like me, I would sooner set up another tank than part with one!
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Re: can someone please settle an arguement?

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